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  • Hugo-FOU
    Original poster 174 posts

    I was going to wait until I’d finished Motherland to post this, but I’m pleased to say, that’s taking some time, so thought I’d share some thoughts whilst I have the time to write it. I’ll perhaps come back and add my thoughts on the content I’ve not yet played.

    The Good.

    Motherland overall plays very well. The missions are pretty good overall and generally make sense.
    There’s also some decent variation. Obviously there is repeating of mission types, but that’s to be expected. I like having an impact on the game itself.

    Although I wasn’t too sure about the new enemy types, I actually rather like most of them. They don’t feel too much like bullet sponges to me.

    The game world itself does feel a little different. It’s a subtle difference, but has an effect. The Wildlands music helps, I’m certain. Overall it just feels a bit better.

    I like the ‘3 skull’ regions, with the increased numbers of personnel in each patrol.

    I really like the weapon mastery idea. Getting increased mobility, is a game changer when clearing areas and increased handling does seem to make otherwise hard to control guns better.

    I also like some of the new cosmetics. In particular, the future soldier gear and Gorka jackets. It’s great that almost everything is available in all the colours.

    Vehicles seem improved, especially the sounds. Seems Nomad has finally learnt to drive and is not slipping the clutch quite as much.

    The Bad

    Still not crazy about the new Seeker enemy type. The challenge it brings is ok, but even though it’s sort of canon, it still seems a little silly. I honestly think the whole optical camo thing should be written out of future games.

    Although the missions are good, they do sometimes feel a bit easy. It’d be nice if we had the option, to turn every region into a 3 Skull region, complete with larger patrols and greater numbers in bases.

    EDIT: On some of the Destroy the enemy vehicles missions, it would be nice to have a secondary objective, or perhaps have the mission be Destroy or Steal enemy vehicles.

    Its a shame the enemy detection and damage output are still intertwined.

    We could still really do with a armour, weapon, gear, weight, movement speed and agility system.

    Enemy AI are still pretty dumb.

    Tying the weapon mastery system to a ‘complete’ skill tree is, imo, a mistake. We need a way to deactivate any skill we wish. On the same theme, I would still like to be able to reduce the amount of ammunition carried and turn off auto ammo pick up.

    We still can’t sling/holster all weapons.

    EDIT: Still no ability to give individual team members orders, or even bind one team member to Nomad to create two fireteams. Still no ROE.

    Most missions still don’t have a briefing on what we are doing and what to expect, this is a must for a tier 1 team.


    The Ugly

    The BELT. Why are we still stuck with the belt?

    Helicopter animations and controls are still awful and rather immersion breaking.

    Nomad still walks like he has haemorrhoids.

    The Fixit trousers now seem to sit unnaturally high above the boots.

    Vasily still has an extra weapon displayed. A Recon A1 I think, despite the claim that this was fixed. (PS4 Pro, FYI).

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  • rugby_dog
    81 posts

    Couple of things that spoilt it for me.

    The arcade mechanics, like the timed missions and spawning enemies, this has no place in any grown up game let alone a GR one.

    Heavies and the general bullet spongyness, I got killed last night after a shot gunner ran up to me, I planted 3 rounds of M4 into his chest at about 5 meters distance and then he shot and killed me. He didn’t even flinch or move to cover or anything. This needs to change.

    Other enemies, I have to shoot their helmet off, give me a break, this is ridiculous.

    Helo reinforcements are a joke, the way they move etc.

    Most missions still don’t have a briefing on what we are doing and what to expect, this is a must for a tier 1 team.

    Where are tourch (flash lights) attachments on our guns?

    And finally this game needs a weight, inventory management system and armour, helmet etc must have stats, realistic ones.

    Overall it’s an ok game but there are way too many arcade things in it.

  • Hugo-FOU
    Original poster 174 posts

    @rugby_dog That’s a good point on the briefings. As I said in a thread on the other forum, this is an area of expansion, imo. Just as completing the destabilising missions alters the region and the final mission, doing intel gathering missions for each of the other missions could build an intel picture which grants a more detailed briefing.

    I’ve actually noticed enemies flinching more to rounds hitting them, but I agree the helmet thing is OTT and rather gimmicky.

  • Virtual-Chris
    805 posts

    Very good summary. As you know we agree on pretty much everything 🙂

    I like that you called out that the world feels different and the Wildlands music. I wonder how much of a psychological effect that has on our perception? When I hear that music, it’s a feeling of nostalgia and better times and goes hand-in-hand with my fondest memories of the modern franchise. It subtly says… you’re in the right place, doing what you do. 🙂

    So I wonder how much of the change in the world we are noticing is really how we’re treating it now vs actual change. Although I think the Bodark are just more convincing and realistic enemies than Sentinel mall security.

    One other thought on how you and I are are still on our first play through… In my experience, the best hours in any game are during the first play through when you’re discovering the world, don’t know what to expect, and everything is new. Even in Breakpoints broken state at launch, those were still some of my best hours in the game. And for the first time in 2 years, I feel like I’m in that new discovery phase all over again. I’m taking it slow and cherishing every moment since this situation of new discovery is just so rare. But it’s a great statement about how compelling this DLC is… that it’s recreated this feeling of playing a great game for the first time.

  • ApexMandalorian
    15 posts

    I don't like this new forum.

    Anyway, one big ugly part of this update is that for all the talk of being able to shape the world, the worst part of this update is that once you've beaten Conquest mode, there is no permanence to your entire gameplay. I get wanting replayability by still having Bodark and Sentinel around the island, but Liberty should at least be free of enemies. The city is still occupied by Russians, with no civilian presence, no attempted parliament, not even sufficient closure to the story by showing Ito trying to set up a government (so no Auroa police even though there's that pointless patch that's a progression reward). It's vey disappointing in this regard.

  • FcAc-No-Moe
    1229 posts
    I don't like this new forum.

    Anyway, one big ugly part of this update is that for all the talk of being able to shape the world, the worst part of this update is that once you've beaten Conquest mode, there is no permanence to your entire gameplay. I get wanting replayability by still having Bodark and Sentinel around the island, but Liberty should at least be free of enemies. The city is still occupied by Russians, with no civilian presence, no attempted parliament, not even sufficient closure to the story by showing Ito trying to set up a government (so no Auroa police even though there's that pointless patch that's a progression reward). It's vey disappointing in this regard.

    Expecting those kinds of changes or taking their word at face value can ruin your digestive system and bowel movements.

  • Hugo-FOU
    Original poster 174 posts
    @virtual-chris

    Very good summary. As you know we agree on pretty much everything 🙂

    I like that you called out that the world feels different and the Wildlands music. I wonder how much of a psychological effect that has on our perception? When I hear that music, it’s a feeling of nostalgia and better times and goes hand-in-hand with my fondest memories of the modern franchise. It subtly says… you’re in the right place, doing what you do. 🙂

    So I wonder how much of the change in the world we are noticing is really how we’re treating it now vs actual change. Although I think the Bodark are just more convincing and realistic enemies than Sentinel mall security.

    One other thought on how you and I are are still on our first play through… In my experience, the best hours in any game are during the first play through when you’re discovering the world, don’t know what to expect, and everything is new. Even in Breakpoints broken state at launch, those were still some of my best hours in the game. And for the first time in 2 years, I feel like I’m in that new discovery phase all over again. I’m taking it slow and cherishing every moment since this situation of new discovery is just so rare. But it’s a great statement about how compelling this DLC is… that it’s recreated this feeling of playing a great game for the first time.


    It’s true, we do. And I think what you say is a good part of it exactly. I was thinking something similar myself. For all that the original story is poor, has terrible cutscenes and appalling dialogue and jut generally doesn’t make any sense, we also first experienced it when BP was at it’s worst.

    By the time we had the Immersive Experience and AI team mates, it was already old.

    This content is undoubtedly better, but it’s compounded by the game being in its best state since launch and being new. Then layered in is that familiar soundtrack and for the first time since launch, I’m actually losing myself in the game.

    I haven’t finished by some way, yet I’m already looking forward to playing through again.

  • Church367A
    147 posts

    When it comes to "The Ugly" I would include in that the overall loadouts on vests as well as belts being so bare bones minimum. IFAK, radio, more than four magazines, and grenade pouches should be standards on nearly all vest and belt loudouts instead of the four mag pouches and a couple extra grenade pouches on the belt. This is a third person game, why isn't the detail on the character of utmost importance in Ubi's presentation? This doesn't even touch on the fact that the magazines displayed on your character can often be incorrect in the event you chose an AK variant or anything aside from what takes 5.56 stanag mags. The ignorance in such a blatant error is lazy indifference and shows a lack of care and passion for Ubi's work.

  • FcAc-No-Moe
    1229 posts
    I haven’t finished by some way, yet I’m already looking forward to playing through again.


    Damn Masochists! 😰

    😂

  • LateNiteDelight
    1040 posts

    @hugo-fou I had zero interest in replaying the original story line.

    I'm highly tempted, despite it's warts, to replay Conquest. Thinking about doing a no fast travel play through. Don't love that they kept the drones, not a fan of more heavies, wish they found a way to steal some CPU power for improved AI.. but it's at least more interesting than the original go.

    Curious to see if this was the last hurrah, or we'll get more DLC next Fall [paid this time, hopefully new map]. Still not expecting a new game until 2023 at the earliest.

  • Virtual-Chris
    805 posts

    @latenitedelight

    I'm starting to think about a second play through that incorporates the best of Story Mode with Conquest Mode.

    I think if you start with the Outcast Faction Chapter Missions (with Sigrid Bloom) and then the Resistance Live Event Missions, followed by Episode 3, and then Conquest Mode, you've got a great set of material to work with. It requires skipping the whole Episode 1 and 2 pieces which did not fit with the rest anyway.

  • Flanker1Six
    228 posts

    Great posts by Hugo and Rugby! + 1

    Hhhhhmmmmmm??????? Good idea, Chris!

  • LateNiteDelight
    1040 posts

    @virtual-chris That could work.

    Secret Squirrel 😥

  • Steven527
    381 posts

    @virtual-chris I am doing one with the first character I completed conquest with. Not doing the missions, just free roaming and dealing with the heavier firepower and responses the Bodarks give. I may do the missions to get rid of azraels but right now they aren't so frequent as they were in the original story mission. The team is an early insertion group to act as pathfinders for Nomad and are now cut off with no comms with the destruction of the Ghost unit.

    My other two characters I am doing somewhat different.
    One is an FBI agent originally tasked to investigate the outcast bombing but got stuck here in the mist of a war zone. Ends up trying to train outcasts.
    The second is a Ghost team, but treating Auroa as if the whole original story never happened.

    I prefer the conquest state rather than story mode so I'll likely continue in this for a while. Convoys are a lot more fun now, the security detachment is larger and more aggressive.

  • Virtual-Chris
    805 posts

    @steven527 ... those are some cool role playing options. I also like the Conquest Mode a lot more for the enemies, music, etc.

    I think that previous premise I had for a character who was a Wolf gone rogue to the good side would also be a good role playing option in Conquest Mode. Let's face it, not all the Wolves are going to be happy with the recent turn of events with the Bodark taking control. I could see a pretty lethal unit of Wolves pitting themselves against the Bodark and helping the Outcasts more from a perspective of... an enemy of my enemy is my friend. :).

  • Steven527
    381 posts

    @virtual-chris I'd do rogue Bodark as the Wolf/Sith costumes suck

    and thanks to you and Hugo for pointing out the music. I always had it shut down prior, but turned it up for Wildlands soundtrack

  • Virtual-Chris
    805 posts

    @steven527 yeah, when I did it, I did not use a Sith outfit... LOL. But I did use some of their more tactical gear, and I really like the MK17 Wolves Edition.

  • Hugo-FOU
    Original poster 174 posts

    @virtual-chris

    Jinx. I’m just working on a thread suggesting an Alternate beginning rewrite, that brings together the elements of some of the episodes and resistance event in a cohesive way, to lead nicely into Conquest mode.

  • DV20Katana
    175 posts
    The arcade mechanics, like the timed missions and spawning enemies, this has no place in any grown up game let alone a GR one.


    This this and this. This practice in games like this should be banned, its utterly infuriating. It turns Ghost Recon into a Just Cause game. They seem to love these arcade timers.

    I have zero tolerance for these timed missions and actively look for trainers that disable in-game timers.

  • Keltimus
    24 posts

    My good vs bad...

    The different areas with different difficulties is a + but the difficulty itself wasn't too impressive. The Tactician constantly calling in back up is a game changer.

    I liked the No Fly Zones, however I think I would have preferred a barrage of SAMs or air to air combat instead of drone swarms. It's a trivial preference though.

    I was very disappointed in the decision to make more enemies with the pop off helmets. I would have preferred a shield rusher partnered up with a shot gunner or something instead of failing to fool my brain to think popping off a helmet with a bullet is practical. The Dreadnoughts to me were just annoying noob tubers who were slow on the trigger. Knowing where they're going to hit as the red highlighted blast area illuminates the ground made them ineffective.

    Weapon mastery is good, though I'm disappointed there wasn't a reload speed category. Mobility makes a humungous difference when moving while aiming. Huge +.

    It seems like enemies can instantly identify friend from foe when driving past them. Understandable during the day, though some vehicles it's hard to believe given the size of the windows. At night, there's no difference.

    I noticed my teammates no longer suppress their weapons when I suppress mine. Maybe its just a PS4 Pro issue? not sure. I can concur with Hugo about Vasily's displayed Recon A1. They still need work as they are now throwing grenades at the hostages and even at myself at times. Why we can't micromanage when they throw a frag and what type of frag they should throw continues to baffle me. Still disappointed in lack of teammate banter. I will repeat my suggestion that the next Ghost Recon have both verbal and physical interactions among the teammates themselves and Ghost Lead. They should behave together as if they were a tight family, not new coworkers they just met yesterday.

    I wish I could switch the IR illuminator on and off. If not, then just have them automatically turn on when aiming down the sights and automatically turn off when not aiming.

    The briefings are good, but need some fine touch ups. Bowman seems to know everything about the region and its not explained how. Throw in "based on rebel intel" or "satellite images suggest" to help fill in those nuances. It would have been better to physically meet up with Bowman and/or Ito at abandoned sites for the briefings at times. Especially in low difficulty areas or after plenty of destabilizing in the region has taken place.

    Sadly the destabilization has 0 effect on civilian activity. Auroa will never be like Bolivia. There are still characters on the island that Nomad interacted with in the past who have skills and could have helped or made an appearance in this update. I don't really miss them that much, but they would have added significant context to the Outcasts being better fighters.

    My least favorite missions were the timed missions that were spread too far out. Some of them were missing a lot of context, especially in understanding what the Bodark were trying to accomplish by dragging hostages far off to another location to put them on pressure sensitive bomb triggers. It would have been excellent if we could get intel from one hostage to find the location of another hostage instead of following blood trails. Even if they don't know the precise location the Bodark took the remaining hostages to, they could still say "they headed east toward ________." It also would have been brutal of the Bodark to use the hostages as bait at times.

    My favorite missions were rescuing hostages being held at gun point and rescuing the prisoners from the Detention Center.

    Much of the cosmetics are meh. The only set I particularly care for was the subdued USA patch and Delta Tactical Gear bundle. I'm glad the FS fans got some gear finally and many of the cosmetics that could not be color coded before now have that option. Sad about the battle belt still inseparable from the characters. Ice Quinn is still waiting on that long hair/don't care back order.

    The weather effects are commendable. I don't know why though, but it feels night hours are short lived compared to daylight hours.

    I think what was missing was continuous defending and attacking regions or strongholds in a tug of war between the Bodark and Outcasts. Enemies having unified tactics as opposed to individual tactics. Ito having her own high ranking officers that we could rescue from the Bodark and later coordinate attacks with. Outcasts and Bodark using ground vehicles with cannon turrets against each other. The Outcasts using drones against the Bodark - which could lead to another content update where the Outcasts split into 2 factions that are still kind of an alliance, but on shaky ground as one faction is for using the drones for defenses while the other faction remains against the idea of militarized drones. Overall, I think Motherland has made Breakpoint a far better game despite some of it's flaws. This is a really good DLC compared to the majority of the previous ones we've been getting.

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