ubisoft discussions

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  • martbloke88
    22 posts
    @bone_frog Thanks for the 2 cents.

    What Im thinking is that the way the AI and game are designed, we can't expect realism settings to just work, i think.
    The AI doesn't react realistically - not to sound (as there is no sound occlusion or echo or ambient sound masking the player's sound) and not to visual (not longer detection time according to distance, no confusion done according to player silhouette or camo, no difficulty to recognize direction of fire due to the player using flash hiders or suppressors, no difficulty seeing players through shubbery) etc etc etc. And the small sizes of the bases\compounds compared to reality mean that making weapons behave very realistically might not really work with how the game is designed.
    And on tope of that, i feel like game balance trumps realism.

    But to each his own, and it's absolutely awesome what @vandhaar did and the fact every player can tweak the values to his liking. I do like stealthing with a carbine but I also love balance and purpose to every tool. So I tweaked my game so supersonic ammo makes sound for about 40-50 meters, SMGs for about 20-30, and pistols are 15 or less. This way, I can use carbines in stealth where enemies are scarce or a bit far from each other, but SMGs are superior to them in stealth. and if there are a few enemies really close, I switch to the sidearm. every gun has a purpose for me. I like it.
    And for the sake of balance and purpose, I even brought back the original damage output (so enemies have 100hp and and my weapons do 25-32 damage (4-5 hits to kill) and this brings purpose to removing the suppressor and more purpose to aim for the head. even though it's not realistic.

    That's just how I roll 🙂

    And the way the game behaves in the wilderness is pure magic now - how enemies can often detect me before I detect them makes for a lot of surprising fights while im travelling on foot, and how enemies converge on my location from all around if I get into such a fire fight. I love it so much. the rural spaces in between missions just feel so much more entertaining now. just bliss.

    @topeira1980 And this is exactly what Ubi need to do if they intend to put these options into the game. Give the player sliders to adjust each of those vahndaar has shown to their own liking rather than just changing the values to a set value that could do wonders for 1 group but not so much for everyone else.

    If the values make it so using a suppressed weapon on 1 side of a base alerts pretty much the entire base, then that would not be for me however realistic that may be. I just want to have using a suppressed weapon alert more than it currently does but not overkill so a slider to dial that in would be awesome.

    Same for detection. If I feel 300m for snipers is just too much at any point, I'd like to be able to reduce the distances to get a good balance of more realism but the game still fun.

  • vahndaar
    129 posts

    Most of this is as you say down to personal preference. The best outcome would be to give the players more granularity and options when it comes to customising their experience.

    I watched an interesting video last night talking about how GRB might not be a great example of a GR game but it has indeed become the go to third person tactical game for many gamers of all ages based largely on the ability to customise the experience to suit a range of tastes and preferences.

    Expanding on this and offering more choice is highly likely to grow the player base much more than trying to target segments of the market with marketing and offerings such as raid etc. or even one off content such as the episodes and events. We need a strong story sure, built on deep, dynamic and well constructed systems but once the story is finished then what remains is the underlying systems and simulation - a sandbox essentially, and making that sandbox dynamic with responsive factions and territory and highly customisable preferences is one of the key factors to ensure longevity and a consistent player base. Add a custom mission creator to that and in all honesty you have a game that the community will play for year after year.

    I've been all over and explored nearly every nook and cranny of Auroa in my time with it over the last two years and whilst the world has its issues I would do it all again given the right reasons or incentive. Being able to experience the game in different ways by changing a few variables is often all that's needed to keep the experience fresh and bring players back.

    Less really is more and a few well thought out tweaks can generate as much excitement as a whole episode of expensive to produce content.

  • topeira1980
    63 posts

    @martbloke88 If you're using this mod, you can easily tweak the mod yourself. Just like I did. And I have zero knowledge in coding or scripting.

  • topeira1980
    63 posts

    @vahndaar I'm with you.
    I think that just that tweak making enemy detection radius much larger simply transforms the entire exploration experience.
    Those tiny insignificant pockets of enemies (2 dude next to 2 bikes. 3 Dudes next to a helicopter or an antenna, etc) turned from a completely mundane boring encounters that do nothing for the overall experience, and into a trigger of a chain of event that can escalate to a hunt in the wilderness.
    A year ago I was always wishing that a wanted system in GRB would simply me that if you are discovered than all enemies about 300 meters will become alerted and converge on your location. Not magically infinitely spawn like in GTA or GRW. and if you keep fighting them, only then a couple of vehicles with Spec ops would appear. That was kind of my dream for the exploration part. And your mod does almost exactly that! it's takes 80% of the map that was only mildly entertaining into an unpredictable and exiting affair 😄

    And I agree with you wholheartedly that sometimes just knowing what to tweak can do a lot to a game. I am not a modder really, but i did create 2 or 3 mods for Skyrim and Fallout 4 (where modding is simple enough for my puny skills) and they seemed quit popular for a while and made big impact on my gameplay in those games. just tweaking a tiny element within a game made a pretty significant change on my enjoyment.

    p.s. I suggested in the nexus forums a tweak to make the game only save on bivouacs (Not all those frequent autosaves), so there is a survival feel to it. Don't know if you saw it, if its even possible or what you thought of it. I think it's an example of such a tweak.

  • Rush.v.s
    1 posts

    Wonderful mod, complete gamechanger. Getting to any point on Auroa is not a promenade anymore, you can be spotted anytime which can lead to a risky fight, base infiltration feels completely different with increased hearing range, and finally there's reason to use pistols, smg's and dmr's not just for show, every class has its own purpose. Great job.

    @vahndaar , I have two questions.
    First: is weapon noise level based on ammo it uses or on weapon class? I mean, for example, will honey badger w/ silencer which in game uses 7.62 be heard only at ~30m or at ~150m?
    Second: is there any chance to manipulate time which enemy units stay on alert once disturbed? Especially, if there's possibility to change time for "yellow", "orange" and "red" levels apart from each other - theoretically this can allow to tweak AI and will do more impact on gameplay in addition to what your mod already did. Just imagine enemy soldiers who keep searching for you after unfortunate shot, since they know the threat you're imposing, or the seekers who don't turn off their optic camo until you get killed.

  • vahndaar
    129 posts

    So weapon audio signature is based on class, I don't know if this is then applied to individual weapons or not but even if it could be it would be quite complex as there are a ton of different weapons. All that's happening currently is that a multiplier is applied to whatever the base values are.

    I wouldn't mind being able to tweak the alert cooldown and even time to alert but haven't looked closely at it yet.

  • Steven527
    372 posts

    @bone_frog with the limitations of the game I am heading in a "slightly" different direction. My sidearm is for the quiet kills. The SMGs just generally don't have the reach and accuracy needed with the mod from @vahndaar and my AI team doesn't really understand what "team" means. I believe they think watching my 6 is a reference to the beer back at base.

  • Virtual-Chris
    Original poster 798 posts

    @steven527

    I’ve stopped using suppressors on my handgun as I’m now finding myself using my handgun more when I’m seriously injured (you are forced)… and it’s a matter of survival. 🙂

    They should make swapping to your handgun faster if there’s no suppressor on it.

    But my team is also such a joke… Like when Midas (my Vasily sniper) is yelling at me “Watch out a Sniper has a bead on you”… I’m thinking… “Why the **** don’t you do something FFS and take them out?”… then Bam! I take a round. <smh>

  • Steven527
    372 posts

    @virtual-chris too funny. I actually don't have Vasily. I wanted my teammates to go single primary and for some reason they still have Vasily with two showing. I am looking to see if I can select one that doesn't toss grenades at my feet or when I have just asked him to sync shot target someone.

  • Flanker1Six
    228 posts
    @Bone_Frog "the teams preferred the MP7 for ergonomics. Training time is limited and learning a new reload system is hard. The MP7 used a traditional reload system. So even if soft tissue damage is greater with with the P90, not fumbling a reload is a more than fair tradeoff."

    LOL! Funny you should mention the ergos/muscle memory issue. I've had any number of semi auto hand guns over the years. Started out on a 1911 Colt Commander model. Everything else since (until very recently) had very similar controls on it (slide mounted L side mechanical safety, mag button L side at rear of trigger guard, etc). Then I bought an FN 5Seven. Loved the gun! Very little metal; amazingly light even with a 20rd mag of SS197s. Shot easy, very accurate, better range than 9s, 45s, 40s, etc.

    Absolutely couldn't stand the blinking safety! R side of the frame, in front of the trigger guard??!! Seriously FN?! Jeezo Pete! 1911 style controls on their P45 seies, many/most of their 9s and 40s, not to mention the Grand Daddy Browning Hi Power! Just COULDN'T get used to (or come to like) the safety when practicing. You're right; if you ever have to draw for real against an armed opponent-----------------NOT a good time to pull a Homer Simpson and [censored] your drill.

    Kinda like I mentioned on the NGSW competition in that other thread. All three look to be great systems, but two of 'em offer just too much "new and different" and likely will lose out.


  • Flanker1Six
    228 posts
    @Virtuql-Chris I’ve stopped using suppressors on my handgun as I’m now finding myself using my handgun more when I’m seriously injured (you are forced)… and it’s a matter of survival. 🙂 They should make swapping to your handgun faster if there’s no suppressor on it. But my team is also such a joke… Like when Midas (my Vasily sniper) is yelling at me “Watch out a Sniper has a bead on you”… I’m thinking… “Why the **** don’t you do something FFS and take them out?”… then Bam! I take a round."

    🤣 Can't begin to count the number of times I've cursed those morons (well...............they are more A than I after all!) out for that. Heck! Even if they're not killing the sniper they could make a rudimentary effort to suppress them.

    NOTE TO UBI: Priority Team NPC fixes: 1: DO NOT revive player in front of enemy NPC/s who've just wounded player! 😒 2: DO NOT revive player while in a burning vehicle---pull player to safety FIRST! 😒 3: DO NOT shout sniper warning to player while taking NO counter sniper action-----suppress/kill sniper WHILE shouting warning to player! 😒 Just sayin..........................


  • Virtual-Chris
    Original poster 798 posts
    3: DO NOT shout sniper warning to player while taking NO counter sniper action-----suppress/kill sniper WHILE shouting warning to player! 😒 Just sayin..........................

    This!

  • martbloke88
    22 posts
    @martbloke88 If you're using this mod, you can easily tweak the mod yourself. Just like I did. And I have zero knowledge in coding or scripting.

    @topeira1980 Unfortunately I do not have the luxury of this awesome creation as I am console 😭

  • FcAc-No-Moe
    1137 posts
    @Flanker1Six
    Can't begin to count the number of times I've cursed those morons (well...............they are more A than I after all!) out for that. Heck! Even if they're not killing the sniper they could make a rudimentary effort to suppress them.
    NOTE TO UBI: Priority Team NPC fixes: 1: DO NOT revive player in front of enemy NPC/s who've just wounded player! 😒 2: DO NOT revive player while in a burning vehicle---pull player to safety FIRST! 😒 3: DO NOT shout sniper warning to player while taking NO counter sniper action-----suppress/kill sniper WHILE shouting warning to player! 😒 Just sayin..........................


    LOL, being there done that and got multiple t-shirts but since it seems everyone (or most everyone here) is happy with that mediocre attempt at making a decent shooter game, I don't believe this is one the hotfixes we will see soon. Then again, if people keep giving this type of eloquent feedback we can see it happening for the new title in 2029 😕 ... just don't expect it for the one coming sometime soon as the one who know better say it will. 😊

    Oh and I think I asked before but just in case I didn't .

    Chris or Vaandhar, if I have an unused slot, can I have the mod in that slot while having my 2nd slot with the Motherland DLC and the 1st slot with the std vanilla game, even if unfinished?

    My question is if I could switch from slot 2 to 3 and viceversa w/o having to go to a lot of trouble? modification wise.

    Funny how I can build my own gaming rig but when it comes to networks or things like this Mod, I'm mostly a Teammate 😀

  • Virtual-Chris
    Original poster 798 posts

    @fcac-no-moe

    You can turn the mod on and off at any time for any save slot by pressing Alt-tab to get access to Cheat Engine. There’s no way to automate turning it on or off though.

    1. Alt-tab from game
    2. Click on mod to activate or deactivate
    3. Alt-tab back to game

    🙂

  • vahndaar
    129 posts

    Yeah it doesn't touch any of your save data - I won't be touching anything that does. You can flip it off and on as Chris says but best doing that from the main menu so that the settings all take right away.

  • Hdwc_
    176 posts

    @topeira1980

    And the way the game behaves in the wilderness is pure magic now - how enemies can often detect me before I detect them makes for a lot of surprising fights while im travelling on foot, and how enemies converge on my location from all around if I get into such a fire fight. I love it so much. the rural spaces in between missions just feel so much more entertaining now. just bliss.

    Wow, this made me think to Operation Flash point situations which already in 2001 were possible, incredible that in a game made of a so bragged about open world oustanding map, this wasn't actually causing any fear of being watched or else, especially in those moments of Dusk where enemies can confuse with trunks etc... which is what very trivially speaking I know was happening in darkening scene when playing Operation Flash point... in Summer 2001 I remember.

    Anyway...I understand these emotions in times of selling of ones emotions in order to gain followers, is not everyone cup of tea.

    @vahndaar

    What I'd really, really like to do is allow for clearing of individual locations. But that's a challenge. Ideally I'd have it so that when locations are 100% looted the enemies don't respawn. I've been wanting that from the very beginning.
    It's needle in a haystack type stuff. Or more like finding a specific grain of sand on a beach.

    It would be cool if we could add something like "procedural destruction" of "ours"... so basically you leave destroyed cars on place, and also all that the game allows being destroyed stays there, doesn't go away. This would really create a sort of perstistency and cheap realism despite the difficulty to find that grain is from your words not looking like something is cheap to find ... \ of course this cheap procedural destruction narrative we would interact with would entail that when we raid a place we go for the burn all policy before we leave (typical weapons disposal policy, on site).
    Instead bodies should not stay on the ground as the "narrative ellipsis" would make up that we are not seeing the opfor coming in to recover\casevac 'em... (another mechanic probably depending on the gmae setting, ubisoft should take care of one day in next game . I repeat, depending on the context). \ in the case of SBC I was saying it could even burn their own brothers as SBC is a bit crazy in Bolivia.

    @martbloke88

    Same for detection. If I feel 300m for snipers is just too much at any point, I'd like to be able to reduce the distances to get a good balance of more realism but the game still fun

    I would put if possible 700 metrs at least. I don0t know if enemy can shoot you at that distance. it might break the game and crash it maybe due to technical limitations (?!)... for me challenge is fun. I don't like to run in a game, sure not stay still saying for 30 minutes what to do while the sun moves... but still be in realistic situations, cinematic in terms of interpreting reality...

  • Rookie-31st
    18 posts

    Speaking of snipers, make sure to find best cover when using strike drone because snipers on alert will find you and shoot you even 250-300 meters away.

  • Hdwc_
    176 posts
    Speaking of snipers, make sure to find best cover when using strike drone because snipers on alert will find you and shoot you even 250-300 meters away.


    This opens up to really whole new levels: from "we are coming to check where you are" very low level handholding cliché, everyone is fed up with.
    To actually realism: "if we are being hacked, there must be someone around that is hacker-pilot spotting and verifying if targets are hit" (AI mechanics- narrative ellispsis), sure... if the game allowed us to do POV drone controlling that would bring strategical power to a whole higher level...
    I hope that the sniper can be brought to higher level of realism based simulation (650 m+), I understand there are few like me that like the challenge and cut the discussion short saying "it has to cohabit with playability" or balanced with fun (like fun was objective, or permadeath wasn't fun and thrilling...) ... but I'll not lose hope isn't in players and potential immersion seeking ones, despite this.

    Regarding strategy, I never understood why more space has been given to RPG which allows a lot of too light\childish stuff (just look the the class concept art and features generally speaking it's all ARcade invasion...jeezz) into especially shooter games, instead of strategy (which is something usually one develops after 15y.o. ... and this despite the GR game targets aged players above 18 surely... more than young targets, and considering that strategy-features allowing game would couple with story based too a lot.
    While instead RPG-ability can kill strongly the canon, creating a lot of player commanded game mechanics deafeating situations...
    Yes RPG for the sake of realism based military simulations or realism sim, and please.. more investment in strategy and tactics ... in GR from now on
    I hope Fortni... Frontline will serve this to us, allowing these targets to be not anymore a matter of interest of GR main game franchise... In 2024-2025 we will know the answer, in the meanwhile the last game gets "butchered" in a good way, from a mod.




  • vahndaar
    129 posts

    Seems to be a gaming trend amongst western studios these days. Simplify and dumb down to cater to younger audiences and to avoid offending anyone.

    Asian studios tend to respect the intelligence of its audience and embrace complexity, learning curves and difficulty. There's simply no tangible reward from candy coated hand holding. It's just a sensory enslaught and not in a good way as it breeds a generation of gamers and developers that haven't the faintest idea of what a good, quality game is.

    I see Battlefield is getting torn apart right now by gamers for the very same reasons.

    I don't know why but there seems to be a bit of an identity crisis in gaming these days where studios want to chase trends and will use brands to do so even if completely mismatched rather than innovate on their own terms, resulting in progressively destroying any goodwill and loyalty the customers and community have.

    By way of example: gore, politics and anything topical is typically avoided, however in M rated or adult titles these things are expected, particularly here where the subject matter is war and warfare and should be treated with the weight and respect it deserves. Tone is very important and this is a grim subject, but that's no reason to avoid it.

    If you buy a Ferrari, you don't expect it to drive like MarioKart. If you watch a horror movie, you don't expect it to be a Disney animation.

    Ubi needs to stick with the identity the community defined in the charter and work towards that at the exclusion of everything else with regards to this franchise.

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