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  • dagrommit
    Original poster 786 posts

    Looks like we're getting another progression system:

    https://www.ubisoft.com/en-gb/game/the-division/the-division-2/news-updates/3Eqa62fOd4sDI1hqjSVdI2

    Expertise is a new way for agents to further develop the performance of their gear, weapons, and skill variants. Thanks to this feature, you will be able to improve the Grade of your equipment and directly increase their base stats for greater efficiency.


    This is different from optimization in that it seems to increase base stats for a particular brand or class of item. Most importantly, there seem to be multiple ways to increase your proficiency, instead of being forced to farm one currency/method.

    I wonder what this means for balancing, as it's unclear whether the 1% increase given as an example is per grade or the maximum possible.

    [edit] it's worth noting that the 1% increase was provided as an example, and subject to change.

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    Contrary to popular belief, Lorem Ipsum is not simply random text. It has roots in a piece of classical Latin literature from 45 BC, making it over 2000 years old. Richard McClintock, a Latin professor at Hampden-Sydney College in Virginia, looked up one of the more obscure Latin words, consectetur, from a Lorem Ipsum passage, and going through the cites of the word in classical literature, discovered the undoubtable source. Lorem Ipsum comes from sections 1.10.32 and 1.10.33 of "de Finibus Bonorum et Malorum" (The Extremes of Good and Evil) by Cicero, written in 45 BC. This book is a treatise on the theory of ethics, very popular during the Renaissance. The first line of Lorem Ipsum, "Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet..", comes from a line in section 1.10.32.

    Contrary to popular belief, Lorem Ipsum is not simply random text. It has roots in a piece of classical Latin literature from 45 BC, making it over 2000 years old. Richard McClintock, a Latin professor at Hampden-Sydney College in Virginia, looked up one of the more obscure Latin words, consectetur, from a Lorem Ipsum passage, and going through the cites of the word in classical literature, discovered the undoubtable source. Lorem Ipsum comes from sections 1.10.32 and 1.10.33 of "de Finibus Bonorum et Malorum" (The Extremes of Good and Evil) by Cicero, written in 45 BC. This book is a treatise on the theory of ethics, very popular during the Renaissance. The first line of Lorem Ipsum, "Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet..", comes from a line in section 1.10.32.

  • SuspiciousPixel
    90 posts

    So max proficiency rank is 10.

    Weapons1% increase to base damage.
    Gear1% increase to base armour value.
    Skills1% increase to base damage/healing/status effect duration.

    I guess it's just another way to put in their words to compliments the Optimization system for players to gain more power.
    For me the game is easy as it is so I hope in the near future there is content that also would compliment new difficult content.

  • dagrommit
    Original poster 786 posts
    For me the game is easy as it is so I hope in the near future there is content that also would compliment new difficult content.

    I see @Merphee is speculating on reddit that the new mode could be balanced around Expertise 👂

  • Adrian-11
    799 posts

    I do hope that somewhere in these announcements they will reveal some real new content.
    Otherwise, we are looking at more grind on the same tired content.
    No matter the new progression (or whatev this is) or spec changes, I can't bring myself to run it on the same missions, same CPs, same locations and maps.

  • TxDieselKid
    205 posts
    No matter the new progression (or whatev this is) or spec changes, I can't bring myself to run it on the same missions, same CPs, same locations and maps.




    This.

  • dagrommit
    Original poster 786 posts

    @txdieselkid Breakpoint introduced a similar (but much simpler) weapon mastery system alongside Operation Motherland. That mode was a mini-campaign with different activities and new enemies on the same map.

    I wonder if the new mode for Div 2 will be something similar.

  • Adrian-11
    799 posts

    @dagrommit

    I really hope is not that...

  • SuspiciousPixel
    90 posts

    @adrian-11 I'm trying to see beyond the lines here but there has to be a reason why they wish to make agents more powerful without introducing a new level cap. However it could just be as simple as someone at Massive is a noob and this is a way for them to finish Legendary missions with slightly more ease lol

  • the_Kettle
    149 posts

    @suspiciouspixel The issue with just upping the level cap is that it would render as pointless all the gear-grinding people have done so far, which would likely cause a fair bit of resentment (at least among those who prefer 'having' to 'working towards'). This way they give us a new grind without invalidating the old grind. They do need to add new difficulty options though, there's enough people complaining about finding it all too easy before this power increase comes along.

  • SuspiciousPixel
    90 posts

    @the_kettle The biggest problem is lack of meaningful content or end game activities. This is just the same gear but with bigger numbers. Maybe people are sadistic enough to enjoy repeatedly playing the same content/seasons over and over again with an added max 10% proficiency but for me this isn't incentivizing enough to play the same missions.

  • LateNiteDelight
    534 posts

    @adrian-11 I assume the new game mode will be the last thing they reveal, shortly before launch. Sounds like the next Annex is about how they're reworking Seasons.

    This definitely doesn't move the needle to get me to log back in, so I'm hoping the new Game Mode is fun. I'll probably run the Seasons if they have more story parts, but don't see myself doing much outside those items unless it brings a fun new take/twist.

  • dagrommit
    Original poster 786 posts
    The biggest problem is lack of meaningful content or end game activities


    IMO, people need to stop saying "content" when they mean new activities, missions or map expansions. The new progression systems, mode, gear and seasons are technically "content" too. I'm happy enough to see the latter, but also want the former - whether paid or not.

  • xcel30
    414 posts

    Well they weren't lying when they said that they were looking for way to make character progression without resetting everyones gear with a level cap or simply introducing same gear but better to re-farm. The focus appears to be in ways to get upgrades while playing in any way or build you want, that kinda fits with how the game works in that builds should be "free-form" in my view, since just using something will let you increase proficiency that will then increase expertise to upgrade gear, i do feel this will be a very badly balanced grind. Am i happy that i can push some weapons or gear just a bit more that might welp some weapons and sets go from barely useful to okay? Sure, but i also think that to reach that i will have to dump so many materials, weapons, overall XP farming that i will salt the earth a bit, because i don't think it will fix the issues such as Double barrel shotgun is such a useless primary gun that might as well be removed from the game

  • Merphee
    41 posts

    @dagrommit ...Well this is awkward. 😗

    But, I mean, increasing the NPC vitality and damage across the entire game in response to what we will gain from Expertise would be strange, because it would be like we never gained power in the first place.

    If the new game mode simply featured difficulties up to legendary, then that would also be strange because legendary can be steamrolled. Expertise only makes us stronger, though it will take some time before we hit max Expertise. To me, it doesn't make sense to only have the new game mode be balanced around the current difficulties, since we will become much stronger than the current maximum difficulty that checks DPS and vitality.

    The 1% is a placeholder. That could become 1.5% or even 2%.

    If Expertise has a cap and is not infinite (I don't believe they've specified), then yeah, it would be easy to balance the game mode around Expertise since you know the parameters. It would be the one end game activity that is meant to be difficult and to "check" your Expertise. Everything else would stay the same to not cause a riot. Would that difficulty revolve around increased NPC vitality and damage? IDK, it's the easy route 🤷 .

  • dagrommit
    Original poster 786 posts
    If Expertise has a cap and is not infinite (I don't believe they've specified)

    I might be misreading it, but this sentence implies Expertise maxes out at the number of weapon & item types in the game at any given time?

    Also, with new content being added to the game, the pool of compatible items will increase and therefore, your capacity to develop your Expertise level further! Another good reason to discover and enjoy new equipment introduced with new seasons!

    i.e. once you've reached max proficiency for a particular item, you have to gain proficiency elsewhere to continue increasing expertise. Do that for all items in the game and you have to wait until new items are added to continue.

  • Warfare2023
    2 posts

    @adrian-11 yes it will be very boring if there are no new missions in the story mode

  • Imagine_Brata
    230 posts

    @xcel30 Double barrel shotgun works greate as main weapon on heroic

  • DutchLMB4ever
    161 posts

    I don't know if I have to be excited or concerned.

    If we get more power on items then Legendaries get even more easy then they already are.

    Unless the new game mode is just a new difficulty.
    Let's say: Mythical mode.
    Which sounds good BUT
    Is that again only 3 strongholds/missions??

    And if its like that do we get a Legendary open world?
    Because with more power Heroic becomes Challenging, Challenging becomes hard, etc etc.

    But... Legendary world wouldn't work, if NPC's spawn behind you while you fight enemies in front of you, you are 100% done.

    So it has to be a new game mode right?
    But again if the higher damage/armor/skill efficiency is made for that game mode, then everything else gets too easy.
    ESPECIALLY if that new game mode is not worth to repeat (like kenly) and we go back to what we already had.

    And what if we get a perfect Mythical mode on all missions.
    With all factions being there instead of only white tusks, so we can farm all the factions bla bla bla.

    What about the weak players that are gonna complain because they can't do it (but they have a 6000 watch level from playing challenge mode 12 hours a day, so they consider themselfs Elite players)
    (Which is 6000% gonna happen)
    Is that mode getting nerfed so that players that are weak can do it too?
    Or
    Does it stay like how it is and those players actually have to step their game up and learn how to play this mode??

    I already know what's gonna happen tho...

  • Oatiecrumble
    310 posts

    Can't see the point of this unless they have something hidden up their sleeves they ain't mentioning yet 👂 👁

  • SevenNVD
    84 posts

    @oatiecrumble

    Must be so, right? In essence, we don't need to gain more power. Most of us are comfortably playing legendary and raid content already, so if there's new power to be found, I assume we will get something juicy to use that power for.

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