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    FcAc-No-Moe
    Original poster 1252 posts

    Ok, so again, I love this mod there are no words to describe it but I can never get tired of praising Vahndaar for it.

    Now, there are a couple of things, well may be a few as I go playing it even more, that I would like to fix, perhaps manipulate or change a value is a better word?

    Ok, for instance, that the enemy has a more eagle eye than before is not a problem, it does bother me a bit that they do so w/o really having LoS on me but as I stated before, that is a core flaw and not an issue with the Mod but, one thing that consistently does bother and it takes the immersion and the fun while playing with the mod is:

    1.- Even long distance shooting ends up with an all out firefight and I would love to adjust this value where the hearing would not be as acute as it is right now?

    2.- Turrets once they go red will shoot at you no matter where you are or what type of cover you use and the detrimental thing is that they will kill you. This I definitely would love to fine tune. It happens more often at distance than closer to them (as I have yet to be able to test this on Urban bases) it just happened to me on Outpost Red Tiger near Lake Clearwater were the USP Tactical weapons' case is. I am perpendicular to the turret mounted on the Helo platform, this means the Helo is blocking the turret from seeing me and so is the structure plus the hill plus the big trunk I am taking cover under)

    This is more of a question, at what distance does the 5.56mm round loses its power or potential to penetrate? I say this because I feel that short shots (less than 75 meters it only requires 1 shot to kill an enemy but +100 meters is when 2 or 3 are required and sometimes even from a 7.62mm (DMR G28). No, I don't have exact distances, this is more seat of the pants but close enough.

    Thanks guys, perhaps once most of us learn how to play with this CT, we can have an even better Mod because we can use different values that we have tested. I am going to start to pay more attention to detail even more so for the questions I want answered.

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  • stdape
    30 posts

    @fcac-no-moe Problem is what the Mod can Change, a lot is locked by UBI. Also you can adjust settings with the Mod. I have put the Enemy Sighting down to 2 (is 3) same as changing weapon amounts. IF UBI ever wake up, we may get more control. Also a lot of problems lie in programming, which UBI are not ever changing. But the MOD is a game changer for us serious players 🙂

  • FcAc-No-Moe
    Original poster 1252 posts
    @fcac-no-moe Problem is what the Mod can Change, a lot is locked by UBI. Also you can adjust settings with the Mod. I have put the Enemy Sighting down to 2 (is 3) same as changing weapon amounts. IF UBI ever wake up, we may get more control. Also a lot of problems lie in programming, which UBI are not ever changing. But the MOD is a game changer for us serious players 🙂


    Oh and I agree, fully, hence why I come to ask and hopefully explain enough where Vahndaar and others like you that perhaps are more knowledgeable with the CT, if what I am asking is possible or not. Depending on the answer, I have to change my tactic and/or approach, which as of late (past few years) have been pretty much the same... shoot, move & back away, shoot, lateral move , approach closer, shoot, move & back away... rinse and repeat)

  • Virtual-Chris
    805 posts

    @fcac-no-moe

    Just to check… you know you can change the values in the mod for things like hearing range? This should address one of your concerns about audible detection.

    However I think in a setting like Auroa, where everyone is on edge, gunshots that can be heard - even a long ways off - should put people in a higher state of alert. So I’m not sure why you want reduced audible detection range. What’s your thinking?

    In my view the game engine cap of 200m for all sound detection has to go. An explosion, a helicopter landing, etc should all get everyone to pay attention at much further distances than 200m. And if anyone fires an unsuppressed 50-cal in the same valley as me, it would likely put me on edge.

    And I completely agree that enemy LoS not factoring in vegetation and other concealment needs to be addressed. Maybe this limitation in the engine is one of the reasons detection was so nerfed in the vanilla game. However, given the choice of unrealistic LoS with more realistic detection distances vs blind enemies, I’ll take the former.

  • Virtual-Chris
    805 posts

    As for damage fall-off over range… I haven’t tested that. But I did test enemy bullet sponge considerably (mostly at sub-100m range) and a 5.56 takes several body shots to down an enemy in the vanilla game. It’s much improved with the mod. I have a thread here on the testing I did. I really doubt it’s possible to kill in this game with one body shot from a 5.56, even with the mod. But in reality, it’s certainly possible. One shot to the heart without a plate and you’re toast.

  • FcAc-No-Moe
    Original poster 1252 posts
    @Virtual-Chris Just to check… you know you can change the values in the mod for things like hearing range? This should address one of your concerns about audible detection.

    Well no, not really and even if I did, the issue is Knowing How to change those values. Perhaps a crash course or is there a " How To " somewhere?

    @Virtual-Chris However I think in a setting like Auroa, where everyone is on edge, gunshots that can be heard - even a long ways off - should put people in a higher state of alert. So I’m not sure why you want reduced audible detection range. What’s your thinking?

    In my view the game engine cap of 200m for all sound detection has to go. An explosion, a helicopter landing, etc should all get everyone to pay attention at much further distances than 200m. And if anyone fires an unsuppressed 50-cal in the same valley as me, it would likely put me on edge.


    Well not really knowing Real World values is hard to say but even if I did, we need to assign Game Real Values where there is a balance between shooting and enjoyment w/o having to start a ruckus every time you start a game, get out of a Biv or are near a Base.

    For instance, if you fire a shot with a Long Gun (SNR) unsuppressed from 150 + meters then sure, 200 meters around I do believe is ok for everyone to hear the shot, start asking question of where the shot came from, etc, etc, but NOT for everyone not even the guy being shot at and the round missed him to know (with pin point accuracy) where the shot came from and because the core game flaws do this immediately (at least for me, normally either the missile dude or the mortar stationary) then this is why I want to quiet down the audible detection range a bit. I want to make the game hard but not annoyingly hard and there is a difference. The great thing here with this mod is that we each can find our ceiling between enjoyment and annoyment ... or at least, that is my hope.

    Hell, perhaps there is another value that can be change specifically for this type of issues with the game, Not knowing much about Gaming Lingo I grab the basic stuff hoping that I am hitting it in the nose or at least nearby. So, if the audio is not the culprit in this scenario that perhaps something else is and hopefully that can be addressed?

    @Virtual-Chris And I completely agree that enemy LoS not factoring in vegetation and other concealment needs to be addressed. Maybe this limitation in the engine is one of the reasons detection was so nerfed in the vanilla game. However, given the choice of unrealistic LoS with more realistic detection distances vs blind enemies, I’ll take the former.


    I can agree with you here but I am hoping, somehow, that is not the case, otherwise, what a horrible way to code or program a shooting game do you not agree? I have a glimmer of hope that the studio, as asinine as it is to come up with some illogical ways to do things, are more logical when coding or programming things like this. One can only hope!

    Thanks for your input, this is a good discussion I do believe.

    @Virtual-Chris As for damage fall-off over range… I haven’t tested that. But I did test enemy bullet sponge considerably (mostly at sub-100m range) and a 5.56 takes several body shots to down an enemy in the vanilla game. It’s much improved with the mod. I have a thread here on the testing I did. I really doubt it’s possible to kill in this game with one body shot from a 5.56, even with the mod. But in reality, it’s certainly possible. One shot to the heart without a plate and you’re toast.


    I am ok with the 1 or 2 shots with the 5.56mm (headshot is a 1 shot kill) but as soon as you go at more distance (and again, I have not measured or gauge this accurately) it seems like there is still a blockage somehow, I can't describe it but it is there.

    I could be confusing the situations but it could happen more often when you just got hit (from distance mind you) and you start to return fire, that is when it seems my shots just miss them completely whereas they have more chances of killing you, and of course, by the time you hit the wheel and give Fury the order to go batchet crazy, you are already turned into swiss cheese. Now, if what is happening here is what used to happen in OGR when you got hit on a limb then I am ALL FOR IT but, it also needs to work the same with the enemy and therein lies the problem.

  • Flanker1Six
    228 posts

    My advice is to make note/record of vaadahr's original mod values. Then just do some stat tweaking (experimenting) with parameters you'd like changed. Sooner or later......................you'll get the mod to YOUR sweet spot.

    Neither the game, nor the modded game will ever be able to realistically model sound transmission, or player/NPC hearing. Wwaayy too many factors to account for. Individual hearing acuity, wind speed, direction, audio ambient occlusion, mechanical occlusion, ambient back ground sound/noise, suppressed/unsuppressed decibal levels of specific weapon/cartridge combos, etc, etc.




  • FcAc-No-Moe
    Original poster 1252 posts
    @Flanker1Six My advice is to make note/record of vaadahr's original mod values. Then just do some stat tweaking (experimenting) with parameters you'd like changed. Sooner or later......................you'll get the mod to YOUR sweet spot.

    Neither the game, nor the modded game will ever be able to realistically model sound transmission, or player/NPC hearing. Wwaayy too many factors to account for. Individual hearing acuity, wind speed, direction, audio ambient occlusion, mechanical occlusion, ambient back ground sound/noise, suppressed/unsuppressed decibal levels of specific weapon/cartridge combos, etc, etc.


    And that would be just Awesome... if I knew how to do that. Perhaps on the other Post, the initial one, there is a way to do so, a crash course given if you will and I missed it? if not, perhaps in that post there should be so we live this one here for questions like what we have now?

    If not, posting it here is fine

  • FcAc-No-Moe
    Original poster 1252 posts

    Oh and speaking of other issues, I am guessing this is going to be a LOUD NOOOO! but I gotta ask.

    Can this Mod help fix or alleviate at least the horrible horrible & atrocious audio issues where you hear the enemies talking like they are 10 meters away from you and the sound coming from your 6 only to find out that they are actually 75 to 100 meters away and to your North West?

  • MikeWeeks
    321 posts
    @stdape wrote:
    @fcac-no-moe Problem is what the Mod can Change, a lot is locked by UBI. Also you can adjust settings with the Mod. I have put the Enemy Sighting down to 2 (is 3) same as changing weapon amounts. IF UBI ever wake up, we may get more control. Also a lot of problems lie in programming, which UBI are not ever changing. But the MOD is a game changer for us serious players :)"


    Here's a good example of a value that folks might like to tweak a bit - however what do the values actually represent, as well as when stating "Enemy Sighting down" - as in changing the mod setting closer to the vanilla game (i.e. "to 2"), or in the opposite direction?

  • Flanker1Six
    228 posts

    @FcAc-No-Moe---after you've got the Spartan Mod activated (red x in the box);

    L click on any parameter line you wish to change.

    Press enter on your KB (this enables a change in the numerical value in the R hand column of that parameter line)

    Type in YOUR numerical value (it will over write whatever the vanilla SM value is. NOTE: Your change IS NOT permanent; the next time you start the SM---all the values will have reverted to vaandahrs))

    e.g. Default SM 9mm ammo is 120; L click on that line (there are 2 lines for each ammo count; all the second lines are set to 0, meaning you won't get ANY ammo refresh in bivouac---change that too; if you want a ammo reload in bivouac); press Enter on your KB; type in desired ammo count. Start game!


  • Virtual-Chris
    805 posts

    @mikeweeks

    If I recall correctly, the mod for detection distance is a multiple. The Vanilla game is the base line (1x)… or about 60-70m. The Mod default is 3x or about 200m.

    The Readme included with the mod covers a lot of what and how things are changed. My review elsewhere here on the forums goes into additional details on some of the mod characteristics.

  • Virtual-Chris
    805 posts

    @fcac-no-moe …No surprise… the mod doesn’t help with audio issues.

  • Virtual-Chris
    805 posts

    Well not really knowing Real World values is hard to say but even if I did, we need to assign Game Real Values where there is a balance between shooting and enjoyment w/o having to start a ruckus every time you start a game, get out of a Biv or are near a Base.


    I know this will come across as flippant, but the job of the mod is not to make shooting more enjoyable. It’s designed to make it more realistic. In the absence of any real world knowledge, I would suggest you run the mod as designed. It will offer the most realistic experience, but I almost guarantee it will not be nearly as “enjoyable”. Shooting a gun (even suppressed) is [censored] LOUD. It will attract attention and create a ruckus from far and wide. I would suggest you adjust your play style accordingly. 🙂

  • MikeWeeks
    321 posts

    This has been stated many times and in many different ways over the years but I believe it's worth repeating again at this time: how one wishes to "enjoy" a video game is subjective. This is especially true when a modifier has been added to a specific game beyond any option(s) that were put in place by the developer. This goes hand-n-hand with whatever might be the premise, as it relates to the story, that was developed for that game.

  • Virtual-Chris
    805 posts

    @mikeweeks Yeah, don’t get me wrong, everyone should tune the game to what works best for them, and the beauty of the mod is it makes that very easy. What triggered my last post was FcAc’s comment that the mod was compromising his shooting enjoyment by creating a ruckus… well yeah, but that’s the one of the main objectives of the mod 🙂

  • FcAc-No-Moe
    Original poster 1252 posts

    @Virtual-Chris We are bound to have misunderstandings and I kinda under stood where you were coming from with your reply and to blame the mod as such was NOT my intention in the least but I did said, plenty of time that I had never used a Cheat Table before (the word cheat feels like a bad word but I will call it that because that is what you all call it). Anyways, since I had never used a CT, I was hoping someone would give me a crash course on what every value does and MEANS (Thanks Flanker I understood a bit and I am going to play with it some more today) because knowing what it does and means is very important to not screw the whole pooch.

    I have always stated that SHOOTING, more so in a GR game is and should be the priority, a Sun so to speak, Everything (the game) should be built around it and not the other way around but again, it does not mean that I want to spend 1 hour crawling and avoiding firefights out of a Biv to get to a Mission and 2 to 3 hours to clear a base, there has to be a happy medium (for me) and that is where I want to try to get with this Mod, which I love and it has definitely made a Cheety game into something I can play a second time around immerse in it and having fun while I am at it.

    Sometimes I do like to start a Ruckus and the more the merrier but I only play with 1 teammate, I can't stand playing (at least not this game) with 3 potheads, 1 is more than enough so perhaps, just perhaps, the Mod is conducive to more firefights for me because I am not sync shooting the enemy which will probably, if isolated enough, will not make their shots heard by others whereas mine does? I also haven't tested this.

    In short, I know you feel very vested in the Mod, I really do, and perhaps to the point of defending against all odds (see what I did there? reference to an OGR command, I think?) but remember that if we all play with the settings, we just may be able to create different maps (so to speak) into which we can enjoy the game more and not necessarily following the campaign but just doing our own roaming around.

    I do hope this gets my point across which is not something I make easy, I know.

  • Virtual-Chris
    805 posts

    @fcac-no-moe Yeah, of course I agree with you. And hopefully you have mastered tuning the mod… let us know if there’s anything that needs further explanation. My apologies for getting a bit triggered but from my perspective it did seem you were a bit annoyed that the mod was adding realism. 🙂

  • DV20Katana
    179 posts

    Whoa! Where can I get this mod?

  • FcAc-No-Moe
    Original poster 1252 posts
    @Virtual-Chris Yeah, of course I agree with you. And hopefully you have mastered tuning the mod… let us know if there’s anything that needs further explanation. My apologies for getting a bit triggered but from my perspective it did seem you were a bit annoyed that the mod was adding realism. 🙂

    Realism is what I have been asking for the past 10 to 15 years from all of the GR games LOL. That being said, I can't confuse real life realism and gaming realism, they should be close but not equal in my book, otherwise, it becomes a chore instead of a fun moment. Practice makes perfect no doubt but we also need the enjoyment to not be annoying more so after the initial learning curve.

    Today I played with the values at random (stupid I know since I should have written down what I changed) more so because I liked it a lot even though it went the other way a bit too much. This is why I was asking if the number could have decimals or not. Next time I will make sure I write down the values and what I am changing, hopefully, then you guys can help in the what does it mean scenario, which I am still not 100% sure.

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