ubisoft discussions

Quick Suggestions

  • DutchLMB4ever
    Original poster 415 posts

    This is actually for Div3 (if that comes)
    But with examples from Div2

    Oke, so missions are not really more difficult from story till challenging mode (IMO).
    It only really starts getting harder at Heroic.
    I don't know why it feels like this tho.
    Certainly there is something that makes it harder, but I just don't experience it, I guess.
    So I want to make a suggestion for this.
    ‐---------------------------------------------------------------------
    1. Story Mode (Keep it how it is)
    For getting to know the:
    - Controls (Moving/Gear/Weapons/Skills)
    - Map (Activities,Buildings,Loot box locations, etc)
    - Missions (surroundings)
    - Enemies (Ranks/Colours don't mean nothing yet)
    - MatchMaking (to get to know other players)

    2. Normal Mode
    Gets Unlocked after completing the Story Campaign.
    - 95% Red health bars (No Armor).
    These are most of the enemies ofcourse.
    - 4% Purple health bars (Armored).
    This is basically that 1 "lieutenant" in each room.
    - 1% Gold health bars (more Armor & Damage)
    This is actually just the Named Bosses. (+ Heavies)

    3. Hard Mode
    Unlocked after completing every mission on Normal.
    - 70% Red health bars
    All of the common Footsoldiers
    (2 of the Grenadiers/Healers/Engineers group)
    Meaning:
    All Grenadiers & Engineers
    Or all Engineers & Healers
    Or all Healers & Grenadiers
    - 20% Purple health bars
    Variates per mission
    (1 of the Grenadiers/Healers/Engineers group)
    - 10% Gold health bars
    Every Lieutenant per room (+ Heavies)
    - Named Bosses now come with 1 named ally.

    4. Challenge Mode
    - 20% Red health bars
    All common Footsoldiers only
    - 50% Purple health bars
    (2 of the Grenadiers/Healers/Engineers group)
    - 30% Gold health bars
    Every Lieutenant in the room (+ Heavies)
    (and 1 of the Grenadiers/Healers/Engineers group)
    - Named Bosses now come with 2 named allies.

    5. Heroic Mode
    - All enemies have Gold health bars
    - Named Bosses have 3 named allies with them.
    The reason I want this is:
    I'm really missing something in Heroic's boss fights.
    In Normal till Challenging I can get that it's one boss.
    But Keener should have 3 other rogues with him at Heroic Mode.
    Could just be 4 Rogue agents and Keener
    I mean, we have done the Story lore missions.
    Following the storyline.
    (Normal till) Heroic version should be different and harder because its not the story anymore.

    6. Legendary Mode
    - 70% Gold health bars
    Footsoldiers, Healers, Drone controller's, Heavies
    (Variates per mission)
    - 20% Purple health bars
    Grenadiers/Engineers (Variates per mission)
    - 10% Red health bars
    Hard hitting Shotgunners and Snipers (could variate per mission)
    ‐---------------------------------------------------------------------
    Also, Make Legendary Mode so that it:
    - IS NOT FOR SOLO'S/RANDOMS/NOOBS/RAMBOS
    Teamwork & Communication is necessary.

    - Unlockable MatchMaking
    (per completed mission or after completing all)
    You MUST have your own good team at first.
    NO MORE hoping to get carried by good players.
    Or
    NO MORE bots joining your team to get carried.
    You will always be joining decent players or be joined by decent players.

    - Has reasons to have multiple builds
    Not just 1 of the 4 categories DPS/Healer/Tank/Skill.
    But more specific builds like:
    - 1x Sniper, 2x Tank/Dps, 1x Crowd Control (blinder).
    - 1x Shotgun/SMG, 1x Explosive resistance Tank, 1x Normal Healer, 1x Crowd Control (Burner).
    - 4x Tank/DPS (or at least 3 (in a really good team))
    - 2x full Tanks & 2x AR builds.

    - Enemies that come/attack from behind
    Meaning it's not just shoot everything infront of you anymore.
    WATCH YOUR BACK'S
    Doesn't have to be a full wave of enemies.
    Maybe just 1 Heavy or a couple flamethrower guy's.
    So you need a Tank to take the aggro, while 2 keep shooting the front and 1 helps the tank get rid of the Heavy.
    Or Hazard Protection's, CC Foam build and a Healer.
    And you slowly push forward, while the Healer and CC build keep the flamethrowers back.
    Idk

    And a suggestion we all want:
    - Every Enemy Faction gets Legendary designs
    This way every faction can "Invade/Takeover the map.
    And Legendary runners can farm every faction (Tactical Assessments, etc)
    Doesn't have to be immediately (But it would be appreciated)
    You can just implement them per (couple) season(s).
    Like how it is now with The True Son's.
    Or after the Manhunt Target is killed they show up.
    ‐---------------------------------------------------------------------

    Unique Forum Code (For discussions about Legendary)
    Only Obtained by players that completed all Legendary mission's
    I don't know if this is possible, but the code can only be obtained when your account is linked to this forum. (You get an e-mail)
    (people that didn't complete it, can't use the code of someone that doesn't go on forums)
    Anyway
    These players can have a say in if the Legendary Mode should be Nerfed or kept how it is.

    If the Thread stays empty, you Dev's know its way too hard.😅🤣
    If it's only full with PC players you know that it needs adjustments on console, etc.😂
    When there is some sort of Damage Glitch or whatever, everyone that suddenly completed it has to do it over.
    Or just everyone, I mean if you did it without glitches you can do it again right...?

    ‐---------------------------------------------------------------------
    World Tier Short-Cut's (For solo players only)
    "The Game recognises good player's"
    when you do certain things (per world tier) the Game will ask if you want to go to a higher world tier.
    (Dependig on how many missions the game has)

    - From Normal to Hard
    Don't lose more than 90% armor for 2 missions.
    (Stay above 10% armor at all times)
    Complete the missions within a certain time.
    - From Hard to Challenge
    Don't lose more than 70% armor for 3 missions.
    (Stay above 30% armor at all times)
    Complete the missions within a certain time.
    - From Challenge to Heroic
    Don't lose more than 50% armor for 5 missions.
    (Stay above 50% armor at all times)
    and complete the missions within a certain time.
    - From Heroic to Legendary
    No short-cut's, every mission has to be completed on Heroic.
    (The within a certain time is so that people can't take their time as a tank with shield and pistol.
    If they want to take their time, they can play the normal way)

    Successful or not, you must do every mission again.
    Meaning: you can't do the "easiest" mission 10x.
    Every mission has a 1x short-cut option.
    If you fail you reset and can't do it anymore.
    Or...(let's say the game has a total of 10 missions)
    You fail at Normal (mission 1) this means you have 9 missions left.
    And either try to get to Challenge and have not enough (4) missions left to Short-cut to Heroic
    Or
    You finish Normal without a short-cut and have 2 attempts to get from Hard to Challenge.
    Or 1 attempt to get from Hard to Heroic.
    ‐---------------------------------------------------------------------

    - A Kick,Report and Kick&Report option
    Kick
    For players that are AFK more then 30sec.
    Report
    mainly for if you get kicked mid/end of the mission.
    (When kicked now, there is nothing you can do)
    Kick&Report
    When players are "AFK" but move every 10sec, so you can't just kick them...
    But actually for multiple reasons.

    Certain rules to follow for Kicking and Reporting before you can activate random MatchMaking.
    (A in-game contract you have to agree with)

    Punishments
    Depending on what happend you can either get:
    Suspended from doing Legendary content for a X amount of time (a day/week/month).
    Or Banned from legendary content (using hacks)

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  • echolecter
    307 posts

    @dutchlmb4ever Not sure if I need to take all of this serious or if it's just a script for stand-up comedy.

  • AgentOfDread
    8 posts

    @dutchlmb4ever This feels, bad.

    I remember a time when I couldn't do hard-mode because I didn't have good enough rolls/gear. I think targeted loot came out shortly after that though, so perhaps the combination of targeted loot, matchmaking, and new game modes have eased that part of the curve making it obsolete, but at one time it did actually have a perceivable difference.

    "Heroic Mode
    - All enemies have Gold health bars"
    This will result in Heroic being easier than the lower difficulties due to the Protection from Elites stats which, if you try, you can stack up to like 70% or more. So, this wouldn't quite work.

    "Unlockable MatchMaking
    (per completed mission or after completing all)"
    This is an absolutely terrible idea. Some people, not me, but some people actually want to play with their friends right away or if they don't have any friends they do want to use match making right away. You're really sending mixed signals with your suggestions. One second you're suggesting that all content shouldn't be able to be completed solo and the next second you're suggesting that you have to complete it solo to unlock playing with other people? What?

    "Also, Make Legendary Mode so that it:
    - IS NOT FOR SOLO'S/RANDOMS/NOOBS/RAMBOS"
    Making Legendary content for coordinated groups only, umm hello, that's what Raids are and it's exactly why I, a solo player, have never done a raid and it feels bad that I am unable to obtain exotics just because I don't want to play with other people. Just because a game is online and multiplayer, doesn't mean it has to be multiplayer. If everything but raids can be solo'd then it shouldn't randomly add content that can only be done by groups. If they developer's intention is to make the game require multiplayer, have it all require multiplayer (and improve matchmaking), but if the game's intention is to allow people to play entirely solo, make it all able to be solo'd. I do not like the mix. I think you agree too, you're just on the side of require multiplayer and I'm on the side of allow everything to be solo. The compromise feels bad for everyone (which conceptually is the same reason why the dark zone is bad).

    "World Tier Short-Cut's (For solo players only)"
    Your world-tier shortcut suggestions are just going to create a perception that you have to achieve those challenges in order to proceed. Just look at how the long-term Expertise progression system was received. It's a long-term system that's meant to be something to do with your excess resources and people have been shitting on it from day 1 because they wanted to rush it and get maxed out right away instead of taking their time and enjoying the game. This would have the same effect, people will see it's more efficient to do the challenges and skip the world tier and then get frustrated when a single airburst grenade comes out of nowhere and removes their armor. Not to mention this concept completely ruins Clutch talent builds and Armor on Kill builds which intentionally lose armor. If the goal is to not get hit then Armor Regen is a worthless stat too and healing skills and builds. Also once again, one second you're suggestion required group play and the next second you're suggesting required solo play. It really makes no sense.

  • Imagine_Brata
    607 posts
    - Unlockable MatchMaking (per completed mission or after completing all)You MUST have your own good team at first.NO MORE hoping to get carried by good players.OrNO MORE bots joining your team to get carried.You will always be joining decent players or be joined by decent players.

    People like you are not welcome to join me. Discriminate against low-level players in legendary is not for me. They are welcome to join me in Legendary. I have been playing with many new low level players who are better than shd level 3000-5000 players
    It's much better when Low Level players join groups of experienced players.

  • DutchLMB4ever
    Original poster 415 posts

    @agentofdread
    It's not a must do or else you can't proceed.
    It's a if you have an easy time you can try to skip to the next world tier (instead of having to farm till you are lucky enough to get a specific "gear score").
    Do you know how annoying it is to be stuck in easy mode because the game doesn't give you the right gear (for weeks/months)?
    You can choose the short-cut option.
    Meaning you can farm for better gear first.
    Maybe i's not perfect how I described it, but there should be something rewarding for better players.
    Not just 100% luck of finding high scored item's.
    Or having "lucky friends" that drop you gear from their world tier (as their minimum gear score items would be your maxed)

    This will result in Heroic being easier than the lower difficulties due to the Protection from Elites stats

    The Heroic thing is exactly so that Protection from Elites is very handy.
    (So that this "actual hardest" content is for everyone)
    You want more challenge take off the PfE mods.
    Or it could even be on Challenge Mode.
    And Heroic becomes the "training for Legendary mode" (Still the Actual end mode).
    Where you can proceed faster if you use certain builds. (Not a must)
    And Legendary becomes Heroic on steroids, where you do need certain builds (and it is a must).
    Plus some extra stuff happening like 'Enemies from behind'.
    So it's not 100% the same mission but harder.

    some people actually want to play with their friends right away or if they don't have any friends they do want to use match making right away. You're really sending mixed signals with your suggestions.

    They can do that from Normal till Heroic...
    And it's for Div3 so surely people have friends by now from the other 2 games.

    One second you're suggesting that all content shouldn't be able to be completed solo and the next second you're suggesting that you have to complete it solo to unlock playing with other people? What?

    It's just for the Legendary Content so that bots can't join you, or you wasting time joining bots (that have 1 striker, 1 hunters fury, 1 Alps (but no healing skills on), 1 Airaldi (but no sniper), 1 Sokolov (but no SMG), and 1 Aces & Eight's...)
    People that don't understand the game AT ALL and for 1000% just don't belong in Legendaries (yet).

    The unlocking stuff for Solo only, is for the short-cuts to a higher world tier. (From Normal to Heroic)
    YOU need to be good enough to skip a world tier, not YOUR FRIENDS.
    "The Game recognises a good player"

    Making Legendary content for coordinated groups only, umm hello, that's what Raids are and it's exactly why I, a solo player, have never done a raid and it feels bad that I am unable to obtain exotics just because I don't want to play with other people.

    People complain that 8 players are too much for Raids.
    They can now basically do 4 player Raids.
    With Heroic's as "discovery mode".

    Just because a game is online and multiplayer, doesn't mean it has to be multiplayer.

    It's not, from Story till Heroic...
    But because you and others are Solo in a multiplayer game, there shouldn't be content for players that actually play the game that is supposed to be for them???
    What about a single player offline game but it has to be for people that don't want to play an offline game.
    The devs did think of solo players, the game already has 90% options to play solo...
    Why can't group players have something + Rewards for being able to complete it together?
    It's only 10% of the game
    Everything else is for every type of player.
    The whole map is for solo/group, good/bad.
    Story/Normal: (solo) beginners (groups)
    Hard: advanced solo, "bad" groups
    Challenge: decent solo, advanced groups.

    Heroic: excellent solo, decent groups.
    Maybe from here the map/missions become different.
    But that should be the reward for becoming a good player.
    The game becomes fresh again. (Also for solo)

    Legendary: is supposed to be for excellent groups that coordinate together.
    Not for any...one to just complete 'because Legendary sounds badass, I want that too'.
    Legendary doesn't mean "Normal Mode but with a cooler name".
    It is actually supposed to be the hardest content.
    And they now made it so everyone just needs the same easy cheesy build.
    My way makes it actually worth grinding for different builds.
    Legendary enemies don't need to be killing you with 3 bullets to be Legendary.
    They could just have actual weaknesses per type.

    Your world-tier shortcut suggestions are just going to create a perception that you have to achieve those challenges in order to proceed

    No it's not, but it is a way to proceed faster.
    And not just hoping the game drops you 6 items with high gear scores so you can go to the next tier.
    Or having 5 good items but 1 just doesn't drop so now your stuck at a world tier because you're 1 gear score short (for a week/month)
    Vietnam flashbacks lol
    The only flaw I see here is that it can only be done once within all tiers together.
    Maybe it should be per World Tier.
    5 attempts to get from Normal to Hard. (2/10)
    3 attempts to get from Hard to Challenge. (3/10)
    2 attempts to get from Challenge to Heroic. (5/10)
    ‐---------------------------------------------------------------------

    @echolecter
    Do whatever you want👍

    @Imagine_Brata
    And why is that?
    Because I think that the hardest content should be for players that put effort in it?
    And (to be clear) im not talking about low Shd level players, I talk about players with 6 different gearSET pieces on.
    People that only see the bonuses
    (And not read the need of 2-4 of the same pieces)
    People that REALLY DONT KNOW what they are doing.
    I carry/play with anyone, don't get me wrong.
    When I see a low level I just give them anything good.
    (full gear or godrolled attributes for their library)
    I just don't like to play with people that just finished Keener and come into a legendary with purple gear without even trying to get a trash rolled skill build (in the Summit) to at least be a little helpfull.
    But even if they have it, I still think people should only unlock legendaries after completing all missions on Heroic. (In a Div3)
    And MatchMaking unlocked on Legendary after completing that specific mission or all mission's.
    If I join or get joined by someone, I want to at least know they already did it, so we can share tactics and such.

    But besides that we like to carry people.
    And I don't know if this is the right way to explain it.
    But lets say like in real life, would you make someone a manager in your business if that person doesn't know what to do?
    Or do you say to the person:
    Go do a manager education and come back to me the minute you know what to do.
    And their answer to you is: I like Turtles 🐢...

    But i know what you want to say now.
    "This is not real life it's a game".
    and something like: "it should be fun" right?
    Understandable!!
    But I say everyone can have fun from Story till Heroic.
    Legendary (actually Heroic too) is not for fun.
    It's for people that want a real challenge after they did all the Easy story campaign stuff.
    Is it weird that I think that?
    Or is it weird that bad players immediately want to play the hardest content, without even knowing the BASIC mechanics of the game?

    But I guess it must be me, especially when I read the last couple sentences i just wrote...

  • Imagine_Brata
    607 posts
    Or is it weird that bad players immediately want to play the hardest content, without even knowing the BASIC mechanics of the game?

    So you're saying that this SHD level 1 player who joined us on Legendary is bad player? he was better than many high level players I have matched with.

  • GnarlyAtol1793
    521 posts

    @dutchlmb4ever
    the difficulty increase we have right now is mainly driven that we have to pump more bullets into NPCs and that we digest less, which we are partially offsetting with improved stats on gear, guns, from the attributes of the specialization trees, talents, SHD watch and now Expertise.

    There are additionally ways to increase difficulty by more realistic things, eg boss locations are not known and have to be found out, protected by better skilled and equipped villains, hidden in areas which provide less hiding opportunities, battle areas which require higher level of tactical thinking, …

    I fear that the game develops more and more into Doom gameplay instead of tactical agent gameplay.

  • DutchLMB4ever
    Original poster 415 posts

    @imagine_brata
    Didn't watch it as its probably someone on a new account.
    Or a friend on that free weekend stuff...

    But besides that, my point was for bots that want to do the hardest content without knowing the game.
    Not about low lvl players that do know the game.

    I meant:
    - Players with a build similar like this:
    1 Striker
    1 Airaldi (but no sniper)
    1 Alps (but no healing skills)
    1 Hunters Fury
    1 Sokolov (but no SMG)
    1 Ongoing Directive
    - Run in the open like a headless chicken.
    - Die within every 10sec of getting up.

    Any clearer than this next bit isn't possible.
    Legendary should not be for anyone that's a trash player lvl 1 till 50.000.
    But it should be for anyone that is a good player.
    Also lvl 1 till 50.000.

    But for my suggestion (for Div3) everyone needs multiple builds PER legendary.
    So they must farm for certain builds first...

  • waflstoopidgir
    5 posts

    I'm going to be honest, while all of that may sound good in your head, the modern day gaming community would scrap just about all of your aspirations. Players always find ways to "break" the game. Especially the division player base. I bet most of the late division 1 and 2 content was designed with a team in mind but ended up being soloable due to players learning the mechanics and systems of the game and implementing the best possible builds/exploits. Being a veteran player, you should also be very well informed that all the gear/weapons aren't always balanced, meaning by your multiple build legendary idea will end up only consisting of a set couple of builds. This will end up alienating all of the other gear/weapons and anyone who even attempts to use them will be criticized and kicked or harassed. No one wants that kind of environment.
    It sounds like if anything, to really get your "harder content for us good players" idea to work, instead of all this gold/red/purple additions for higher difficulties, the best solution would be for legendary AI to get a rework from the heroic and lower AI. Similar to how hunters can be more aggressive. Every enemy type should have new behaviors and abilities to change things up on the player. But again, this only works if Massive can create a well diverse system of balance over gameplay. Which, lets be honest, has not been consistent even from the first game.

  • DutchLMB4ever
    Original poster 415 posts

    @waflstoopidgir

    the modern day gaming community would scrap just about all of your aspirations.

    Yeah but it's more because people want participation trophies for everything.
    And in my opinion that's why we have Story till Challenge Mode.

    I bet most of the late division 1 and 2 content was designed with a team in mind but ended up being soloable due to players learning the mechanics and systems of the game and implementing the best possible builds/exploits.

    And that should be alright until Challenge mode.
    On Heroic it should be a thing that people can't just play with one build only.
    Still be able to solo it but per combat combat part you need different builds (again for solo Heroic's)
    For groups on Heroic's it should not matter but the right builds make the missions faster.
    And for Legendary a group is a must and every member need multiple different builds.

    Being a veteran player, you should also be very well informed that all the gear/weapons aren't always balanced, meaning by your multiple build legendary idea will end up only consisting of a set couple of builds. This will end up alienating all of the other gear/weapons and anyone who even attempts to use them will be criticized and kicked or harassed. No one wants that kind of environment.

    True and for that reason Div3 should have PvP gear and PvE gear.
    So that buffs or nerfs don't affect things in one or the other.

    And weekly changing pre-made builds for the DZ.
    4 or 8 builds per week. (To test)
    Players give feedback on the builds etc.
    And eventually
    (when all builds are balaned by having the right gear) everyone can choose from any pre made build (No more changing per week)
    So that no one can cry about having to farm for a META build. (Only in 100% PvP)
    If you get wiped by someone in the DZ, you see what they wear and you can choose that same build when you respawn in the checkpoint (build vendor).
    Sorry, I went off topic....

    The way that I want multiple builds makes it so people need other builds in every Legendary.
    Example:
    - Legendary DUA
    The group needs 4 builds each (16 in total)
    - Legendary Roosevelt
    The group needs 16 different builds again.
    Some the same (like a sniper build)
    But instead of 1 being the sniper all 4 need to be snipers.
    - Legendary Capitol
    Another 16 different builds
    (Can't give Div3 examples as it doesn't exist (yet))

    Nerfs and/or buffs can be made later.
    The only real issues would be if the fire does way to much damage while people have Hazard Protection builds on (and just can't survive).
    But in that case the devs can just nerf the fire damage (until HazPro works as intended)
    But then again fire should just do the same damage as always.
    And Legendary gives (idk) 40% weakness to the player.
    So now the players need 40% HazPro to lock out the 40% weakness.
    And on top of that they have 40% HazPro on the normal "fire" damage.
    (Don't know if that makes sense)

    Trying out new builds can be done in friends groups.
    Where the "tester" asks if they can try out this new build he's been working on.
    If it works they can clip it and put it on YT or whatever.
    Then argue with randoms about what is better or this build works too.

    the best solution would be for legendary AI to get a rework from the heroic and lower AI. Similar to how hunters can be more aggressive. Every enemy type should have new behaviors and abilities to change things up on the player. But again, this only works if Massive can create a well diverse system of balance over gameplay. Which, lets be honest, has not been consistent even from the first game.

    I think Heroic should be the same concept as Legendary, without the "must have different builds" mechanic.
    But do have a "it's way faster with different builds" mechanic.
    So people can still play with 1 build only/Solo or learn the ways of how it will be in Legendaries.
    So Heroic is the End Game for Everyone.
    And Legendary is the End Game+ for the "Elite Team's".
    And their should be a unskippable screen that explains that Legendary is for the best of the best team players.
    (Showed once per day when starting a legendary, until you completed 1.
    - Once per day, so it's not after every wipe.
    - unskippable, so it keeps reminding players it isn't supposed to be for everyone.)

    - Hunters are a good example, but Hunters should also be how they are.

    - White Tusk on the other hand are 'too much'.
    (I don't know if that are the right 2 words tho)
    But they are basically Hunters without a bloodthirst.
    The only thing that's hard about them is:
    - They hit us as if it's PvP call of duty
    - They spam grenades/drones
    - 300% repair skills from Healers
    - All guns are like mini guns (infinity ammo)
    - 150% accuracy (headshots) when suppressed

    They can lower all those points and give them weaknesses instead.

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