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  • JCar4327
    617 posts

    @quor321 While I do agree that the history surrounding Ragnar is debatable because much of what is known about him was passed down through oral histories, it does not make true that "RAGNAR LOFBROG IS A FICTIONAL CHARACTER FROM A MOVIE-SERIES". This is what the OP stated. Just trying to clear up that fact. He did, in fact exist, and his sons Ivar the Boneless, Bjorn Ironside, and Ubba were real people in history as well.

    I am sure, while Valhalla is based on historical individuals, the developers took many liberties in telling the story to make a game. I'm not aware of any label that states the game is based entirely on factual and non-fictional events. Nor was Origins or Odyssey.

  • Max18400
    402 posts

    @jcar4327 Britannica is not a reputable knowledge place. Like it's information fur the most part is not wrong, but it's not consisted a reliable source as anyone can edit it.
    If you cited it or Wikipedia as a source in a historical paper, it would be discredited.

  • Max18400
    402 posts

    @quor321 it's not necessarily the further back you go... It's more the written and archaeological sources a not great for information after the fall of Rome. You can really renouned scholars, such as Guy de la bedoyere, states that amount and quality of the physical evidence seems to really dramatically reduce after 410 in Britain.
    As with Ragnar... Scholars cannot agree. The sagas are written several hundred years after the events, and the only contemporary source that mentions him clearly is the Annals of St. Bertin as it records that he sacked Paris. So he's a character at the edge of history. So you cannot prove of disproof his existence either way

  • JCar4327
    617 posts

    @max18400 I'm not sure where you got that. Britannica can only be edited by its editors.

    The Editors of Encyclopaedia Britannica | Britannica



  • Max18400
    402 posts

    @jcar4327 oh sorry. I didn't know that/had heard differently from my professors at University. However I do know it's not regarded as a reliable source. I've studied the viking age at university for just under 5 years and have 2 degrees on the subject. Literally on day one they will say you cannot cite it as a source in a paper as it's not consisted reliable as it's consisted 'popular history' which is effectively say it records/compresses history to fit either a narrative (so it'll sell) or to make it accessible for anyone -good comparison is something like a horrible history book. So it's a good starting place to get a general idea, but for better information on Ragnar, I'd recommend reading the Sagas of Ragnar Lodbrok translated, annotated and collected by Ben Waggoner.
    If you actually read the sagas, they focus more on Ragnar's sons than Ragnar himself.

  • JCar4327
    617 posts

    @max18400 I would not have thought Britannica would ever be considered an unreliable source as all through my life it was, but things change. I have read up a little on Ragnar, but yeah there seems to be a bit more on his sons. I have read on more than one occasion that his sons were actually more famous than he was. He started the legend but his sons carried on long after he was gone.

    And thanks for the recommendation. If I get a chance I will try to check it out.

  • Max18400
    402 posts

    @jcar4327 Britannica can also be guilty of really badly paraphrasing sources. For example, it references The Annals of St. Bertin (last I read it like 3 years ago) as saying that Ragnar defeated an army of Franks using psychological warfare (basically what the TV show vikings show Ragnar doing in Mercia in season 3).yet when I managed to get the edition of the text cited, it didn't say anything of the sort. That story is in a completely different text which wasn't even cited on the website.
    I want to emphasis, I am not dissing Brittanica as a general source as it can be very useful as an initial starting point/quick input of info. It's just not considered a reliable source by scholars or anyone really in academia

  • Max18400
    402 posts

    @jcar4327 yeah definitely do. His notes on the subject of Ragnar are really interesting.

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